Knowtown...

the ramblings of an ecclesial dreamer

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"We must not be afraid to dream the seemingly impossible if we want the seemingly impossible to become a reality."
Vaclav Havel

Ecclesial Dreamer

My name is James Mills.

I am married to Janell and
we have three kids--Jarod, Matthew and Teryn. We live in Parker, Colorado.
In addition to this blog you can find out more about my ecclesial dream at Knowtown or Missio Dei.

If you would like to add your thoughts to a rambling,
click the "Talk Back" link at the end of each post.
If you would like to talk IM (MSN) me or send me an email at: jmills@knowtown.com

..::Favorite BLOGS::..
Andrew Hamilton
Andrew Jones
Doug Pagitt
Dry Bones Dance
Emergent Group Blog *NEW*
Dwight Scull
Fluid Faith
Jason Clark
Jason Smith
Karen Ward
Katy Raymond
Maggi Dawn
Michelle Bainbridge
Rudy Carrasco
Scott Holden
Scott Raymond
Tony Rodasta

..::LINKS::..
My Personal World Clock
Ekklesia Project
Emergent
The Holy Observer
The New Pantagruel
The Vine
Reconstruction
Observing Differently
Open Source Theology

..::Previous Ramblings::..

The shame of it... I have three more weeks in my Ten Commandments class at Crossroads. Here is a joke that I stumbled across a long time ago that I will share to tie last week (adultery) and this week (stealing)... A pastor in a small town does not own a car so he rides his bike everywhere. One day his bike turns up missing and he is furious. Because it is a small town he is sure the thief, whoever it turns out to be, goes to his church and he does not know what to do. During the elder meeting one of the elders suggests that the pastor preach on the Ten Commandments and when he gets to the commandment "don't steal" he really lay it on. Enough fire and brimstone talk will certainly make the guilty person confess to the crime. Everyone agrees that this is a good idea. The following Sunday the pastor is preaching eloquently through the Ten Commandments and about 3/4 of the way through his sermon he completely changes to a different topic and finishes with a very strong sermon on forgiveness. The elders are all confused so one of them asks him later, "we thought you were going to really hammer the commandment about stealing but you never even got to that commandment, what happened?" The pastor replied, "When I got to the commandment 'though shall not commit adultery' I remembered where I left my bike." posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/30/2003 11:37:00 AM	Tuesday, September 30, 2003
Tyson Edward... Start passing out the cigars. My sister-in-law, Kasey and her husband Jack are the proud parents of my newest nephew who arrived this afternoon at 3:20. Tyson Edward Krape weighed in at 7.92 lbs and was 20 1/2" long. I need to start posting pictures on this blog. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/29/2003 04:17:00 PM	Monday, September 29, 2003
The quest continues… I know quite a few people who have fragmented their lives enough to draw clear lines between their "spiritual" life and their other areas of life. Some of these people are ecclesial dreamers just like me. Where this becomes most noticeable is in their vocations. I know pastors who are tempted to get part-time jobs in an attempt to supplement their income and to give them a connection to relationships outside of their church or congregation. On the flip side, I know people who are working full time and trying desperately to find a way to quit their jobs and become "full-time" pastors. (I guess this just shows that the grass really is greener on the other side of the fence.) But what if life wasn't so fragmented? What if there was not "place" called church that you went to on the weekend? What if you had some meaningful and authentic relationships through your vocation that created a community of faith? What if instead of collecting tithes from people you ran a company that not only provided for your own needs but allowed you to employ others. What if you could pour kingdom content into the real world lives of your community 40 hours a week? I really like this spin on the pastor as CEO model. Maybe those organic relationships with employees and fellow businesses would be your church. What would that look like? My good friend and fellow ecclesial dreamer, Tre Cates, has not only been thinking about these types of questions for a long time but he is putting these ideas into practice. Now he is gearing up to take this idea to the next level. There is no one I know who is better suited for this. Tre, I am praying for you and looking forward to finding some way to continue riding in your wake. Lead on, my friend, lead on… posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/29/2003 02:00:00 PM
A Conspiracy of pretense… I have had several conversations this week about things that are church related. Some of these conversations were with people who are firmly entrenched in church while others were with people who are not church goers at all. One of the things that I have observed is that there is very little difference between those who are “in” and those who are “lost” when it comes to the reality of the lives they live. Both equally get frustrated in their jobs, disillusioned in their relationships and confused about meaning and purpose. Simply put, there are a lot of broken, hurting people out there, both inside and outside the church. The big difference seems to be that those who go to church have the ability to suspend this reality for an hour or so on Sundays. I have my suspicions about how genuine this suspension of reality really is. Like the kid in the Emperor’s New Clothes, we all know that when the church service is over the same reality will be waiting for us. So what is it about the "church service" that holds the power to transcend this reality of brokenness all around us? Is it the music? Is it listening to a gifted speaker talk to us for 30 minutes? Is it the shallow conversations we have over coffee and doughnuts? How do these things transform us in this way and why does it not last very long? Like I said, I have my suspicions. While I think this hour can impact some in a very powerful and meanignful way, the majority of people in an evangelical church service are participating in a conspiracy of pretending. I wonder what it will take for us to stop pretending that everything is going great when the reality is that many of us are hurting and broken. We need more than a few songs and a motivational talk to get us through each week. We need to learn to live--in a real way in the real world-- faithfully with one another. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/26/2003 01:11:00 PM	Friday, September 26, 2003
Reconstruction... Lately I have been enjoying some of the thoughts from Steve Bush, who I was exposed to on the Emergent bulletin boards. He has some great thoughts and ideas that he shares at his creative website, Reconstruction. SOme great essays and links to follow through the rabbit hole. Drop him a line and let him know what you think of his site. Also, make sure to check out his "Do-it-yourself-seminary". Steve is also involved in a community of faith that resonates with some of the things I hope to be involved with in our group here in Denver. I am lookin gforward to learning a lot more from this creative group of followers. Thanks, Steve, for sharing your ecclesial dreams. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/26/2003 09:53:00 AM
Random thoughts... Ihave a ton of thoughts rambling through my head so rather than try to make a coherent post I am just going to throw some things out. First is this great, short article on one of my heroes,Stanley Hauerwas. I really like this ecclesial dreamer. The emphasis on being faithful is good for such a short article. Speaking of Hauerwas reminds me of the Ekklesia Project. As an endorser of this organization I fast and pray every Friday. There are many things that are on my mind this Friday. First, is this growing sense of spiritual battle that seems to be impacting many of the ecclesial dreamers I follow. First, I am praying for the folks involved with Backyard Missionaries. This group of dreamers is influencing my thoughts in huge ways and has been very encouraging to me. The fact that they are under attack in several ways is on my heart. Hamo, Herds and the rest, please know you are in my prayers today. Then there is the stuff Going on with Andrew Jones and company. With the housing situation and Andrews daughter there is much need for prayer there. Finally, there is stuff in my own circles. I have a lot of things going on in my own life that are wearing me down. I am physically, emotionally and spiritually tired. I am excited about some new things going on but I still have some things draining my energy that I need to resolve over the next few weeks. I am finally at a point where I know what I need to do but I need the strength to just do it. I am very encouraged that there are so many dreamers out there who are farther down this road than I who are sharing their stories with me and that we can make this journey together. You all are a great reflection of God's faithfulness towards me. Coming up next I will be sharing some links to some new resources I am finding helpful in this journey of faithfully following God in the way of Jesus. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/26/2003 09:12:00 AM
Thought fodder... Here is a short quote from the Anne Lamott book, Blue Shoe that got my wheels turning about our emerging community of faith here in Colorado. This quote comes early in the book as the main character is struggling to make sense of her messy relationships: "…until her pastor told her that when God was going to do something wonderful, it started with something hard, and when God was going to do something exquisite, He or She started with an impossibility." I like it. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/24/2003 10:47:00 AM	Wednesday, September 24, 2003
Fishing with sticks… So my family spent a long weekend at Rainbow Lake resort. We did some fishing, hiking, eating and playing. My son Matthew caught a nice rainbow trout from the lake at the cabins which made him the only one from our group to catch a fish there. (He was also the only one from my family to catch one in Steamboat Springs earlier this year so I guess that makes him the lucky one.) He also went hiking with me through the brush of the beaver ponds above the lake. We saw some good fish there but we were not very successful at sneaking up on them and it was difficult to fish while keeping Matt dry. So we enjoyed the hike and spent some good time together. We visited a great little ghost town called St. Elmos and walked around looking at the many abandoned buildings that were built in the late 1800’s. It was cool to see them still standing. Then we went four wheeling on Saturday and found ourselves at a great little trout stream high in the mountains. Unfortunately we did not take our fishing poles so we simply walked along the creek. There were brook trout everywhere. Then we remembered that there was one tackle box in the truck. We cut some long branches off nearby bushes and tied on some line and hooks. We crept around the creek flinging in various forms of bait. Carl and Craig each landed one each. Me and the boys had several hits but trying to keep enough tension on the line using sticks was difficult so the fish would wiggle off. We were all amazed at how much easier the “technology” of rods and reels makes it to catch fish. But it wasn’t near as much fun. We had more fun in two hours with the sticks and string than the rest of the fishing combined. I told my boys that when they grow up and have kids they can say, “When I was a boy we had to make fishing poles out of sticks…” They both said the highlight of the trip was fishing "the old fashioned way". Next summer I will try and go back there with a fly rod but I will try my luck with a stick and string, too, just for fun. Janell sent me off to the beaver ponds with no kids and I finally caught a nice brown trout on the last day so at least I didn’t get skunked. But fishing was not really the point of the trip. It was nice to get away from the bump and grind of work for a few days and be able to think about things. I was reading Anne Lamott’s book, Blue Shoe over the weekend. What a great story teller she is. I found myself comparing the characters in her book to people I really know and wondering what it means to "be community" with them. How do we take our ordinary, messy relationships and embody "the Church"? I became more convinced than ever that this is what we need to do-- move beyond the shallow Sunday morning package. Reading the book sparked my imagination for the way things could be and how hard it is for the ordinary searcher to find God in church when their lives are so messy Monday through Saturday. I was very aware how difficult this path will be. Anne has such a great way of putting words together and the book was actually very encouraging to me that investing in something new is the right thing to do. There is a lot that I could offer to the Sunday church package that would keep me busy and create the illusion that I was "doing something for God". I could be involved in a church that ran like a well oiled machine. But I think for me that would be a step in the wrong direction. I don’t want to contribute to a ghost town church. Maybe church would be better for me if it were more like fishing with sticks. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/23/2003 10:54:00 AM	Tuesday, September 23, 2003
Home sweet home... Well we just got back from our long weekend in the Colorado Rockies. Wish you were here. The weather was beautiful. I'll post some more later... posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/22/2003 02:19:00 PM	Monday, September 22, 2003
Poser evangelism… I am going to try and make a long story short and tie it back to evangelism. At work yesterday we had an all day training/meeting on "Management of Aggressive Behavior". It was a spin-off of "violence in the workplace". We have trainings like this often and usually it is to help deal with hostile clients. However, with the recent layoffs there was a strong focus on employee to employee violence which made the whole day seem strange. Anyway, late in the day we had a Denver Police officer telling some great stories to illustrate how to see the signs of violence. He used a humorous story from his vice days to talk about the idea of communication harmony. This is the idea that your words, tone of voice and body language are all saying the same thing. He talked about being undercover trying to buy drugs and how he was saying all the right things in the right way but his body language had “I am an undercover cop” written all over it. This reminded me of the great scene in The Big Kahuna that Rob Lane quotes on his blog. I began thinking of some of my acquaintances here in the Denver area who are involved in “Gen-x” churches. They are all very familiar with the ideas of post-modernity and can speak the language. But when it gets right down to the gospel — what it is and how we communicate it — their body language says, “I am a modern, ex-youth pastor, who is trying to speak your language in an attempt to convert you to a cheesy, watered down version of western, individualistic, consumeristic Christianity and then brainwash you into joining my church and paying my salary. I don’t really want to get to know you, I want to change you and add you to my attendance numbers.” Now I realize I am probably overstating here but I hope my point is coming across. I fear that there are a lot of us ecclesial dreamers who are a little disingenuous when it comes to sharing our faith. We are all aware that church as we know it is really a hospice and to reach the under 30 crowd we need to change some things. So we change the vocabulary and tone of our voice, maybe add an edgy band that plays “secular tunes” and some candles. But in the end our witness and communication has no harmony. We can talk about God’s love till we are blue in the face but if we don’t want to get elbows deep into the messiness of others lives, let alone our own, our “gospel” is not very valuable. Some have said that people will not care what we know until they know we care. I think there is some truth to that but I am beginning to think that people will not care what we know until we are able to live out what we know. Until we become part of a faithful community and embodies our truth claims we are only posers trying to dole out shallow friendships and spiritual services in exchange for equally shallow friendships and a paycheck. People being hunted by the Lion of Judah will see through our posing even after all the lights are dimmed and all that’s left are candles. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/18/2003 09:56:00 AM	Thursday, September 18, 2003
Bold Experimentation... Andrew Herden from the Backyard Missionary crew in Australia sent me an email with this great quote: "A great deal more failure is the result of an excess of caution than of bold experimentation with new ideas. The frontiers of the Kingdom of God were never advanced by men and women of caution" - O. Sanders It was very timely. Along with some others here in Colorado, Janell and I have been dreaming and preparing to be on a mission to explore the outer edges of the undiscovered Kingdom of God. Sometimes in the planning stages we get overwhelmed with trying to balance caution and courage, patience and action. This quote kind of reminded me that its really not about us "figuring it out" before we go. It is more about following faithfully with undaunted courage and "bold experimentation". I was talking last night with Scott Holden about how time was on our side. Then we agreed that when we are participating int the *Missio Dei* everything is on our side. Do we have the courage to really believe that? We'll find out soon enough. In the meantime I have some thoughts brewing about "poser evangelism" (sparked by a meeting at my work and the movie reccommended by Rob) and "what's so good about the good news?" (rethinking the gospel) that I am putting together. maybe spending some time in the beautiful Colorado Rockies with my family relaxing and fishing will help me sort some of these thoughts out. There is something about standing in a trout stream with a fly rod that has a way of speaking to me. I'll post on this soon. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/18/2003 08:18:00 AM
Work woes... My day job is at Denver Department Of Human Services. We have been hit pretty hard by an extended economic downturn resulting in a huge, multi-million dollar budget shortfall. We are all required to take some days of leave with out pay in the near future. Additionally, they are starting to eliminate positions at work. So far I am safe but there is no telling how long that will last. A few years ago this would have quite literally scared the hell out of me, but know I am pretty confident that God will supply all my needs. (If I could only figure out a way to get him to see my wants as needs). Also, Janell put in her request to step down as the youth leader at our church effective the end of October. Not sure if we can afford to do this financially but Janell is very confident that God is leading in this direction. We are making some adjustments to simplify certain areas in our life and lower our monthly expenses. It is amazing how quickly the things we think we own end up owning us instead. It doesn't help that I am a slow learner. All in all I think this is going to be a good re-learning experience for us. But we would still appreciate your prayers... posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/16/2003 11:02:00 PM	Tuesday, September 16, 2003
lost comments... I have been having a world of trouble with my comments server (you get what you pay for right?). I have switched to a new server for comments but I lost all previous comments in the process. Believe me, it was nothing personal! Hopefully this will eliminate the problems. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/16/2003 10:50:00 PM
Maintenance… I spent all weekend working on my car and getting it back up and running. I had to replace a water bypass hose that was near impossible to get to. It was located in a hard to reach area between the engine and the firewall and there was no way to get to it without causing some form of pain. After two days and many scraped knuckles I am road ready again. I couldn’t help but think about how this is a good analogy for the emerging community of faith that my ecclesial dream is pouring into. Sometimes there is some painful work that needs to be done before you can turn the key, start the engine and move forward. But we can’t confuse lack of movement for lack of progress. The maintenance is an important part of the journey. Getting a spiritual inventory/tune-up is essential to the Missio Dei. Also wanted to say a special thanks to fellow ecclesial dreamer, Rob Lane for recommending the movie The Big Kahuna. This is a great God movie and the dialogue certainly makes you think. Lots of interesting things to pull out of this movie that relates to evangelizing in the 21st century. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/15/2003 09:57:00 AM	Monday, September 15, 2003
Chattanooga for me (Janell) I want to start by saying that I really have not read much of what James posted because I wanted to work through a few of my thoughts and get them out there before I read too many of his. So if I repeated a lot of what he said I apologize. I really enjoyed parts of the conference --like seeing friends and spending time with them in varying conversation about God but was very frustrated at times -- like when I wanted to go to a selected session but couldn't because the rooms were too full. Most of the discussions I went to were definitely worth the trip. One of the things that really struck a cord in me was something that Rudy Carasco said the first afternoon we were there. It was simply in reference to people around him speaking Spanish and how well he can understand it but he does not speak it very well. That is how I feel with a lot of the Emergent stuff. I feel like I understand it and most of it is very refreshing for me to hear and listen to but I have not developed the language for it yet. I am not saying that they have a particular code or anything but it is almost like someone that comes to church for the first time and is wondering why people keep asking him if he is "lost" and he thinks " I am not lost I knew exactly how to get here". So I sit back and wonder "how do I get past my language barrier?" I guess a lot of this comes from the place that I am in right now with God and life. I am pretty convinced where God is leading our family but getting there can get pretty sticky and so I understand in my head what needs to be done but I haven't figured out how to work though all of it yet. As a youth leader at our church I have learned a lot of things about myself and our church. Some are very rewarding and encouraging but a lot of it has been a very painful process for me. One thing that is shining ever so brightly for me is that I am not much of a leader! I try very hard and I really want to be but I don't think that is who I was created to be. James says that I am too hard on myself and maybe he is correct but I don't think I got the nickname "Elmers" for nothing. I am like glue -- I hold things together but don't do very well as the head of the class. So, now my quest is to find the best place for me to be using everything that I am. Thanks again for letting me ramble and jump around from thought to thought. I am no where near the writer that James is!!! I need a LOT of practice, but I wanted to post a little bit about Chattanooga since I went too. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/11/2003 08:21:00 PM	Thursday, September 11, 2003
Long week... This week has been like a cliched country song for me. Car broke down, missed some work and my moms dog died. And its only Wednesday... posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/10/2003 11:47:00 PM	Wednesday, September 10, 2003
last Chattanooga post... So as I said, the conference was good. There was great conversation and dialogue about emerging theology and I really feel like I learned a lot. So what’s not to like? On the plane ride home I was processing a lot of this stuff and a couple of thoughts hit me. I would wager that most of the attendees of the convention were going home to churches that do not embrace emerging theology. Very few of us were going back to a Solomon’s Porch or a Jacob’s Well, where the pastoral leaders are open to creating a new theology. The emergent leaders seemed surprised at the amount of people who attended this conference. Just like San Diego the actual numbers were more than expected. Why would over 350 people from more than 25 states travel to Chattanooga to participate in this discussion? Because they can’t participate in the discussion in their own churches or their own location. Based on the conversations I had with individuals over the weekend most of us were heading back into a conflict. Some I talked to were worried about losing their jobs if they talked too openly about the ideas that were born from the conference. Others were wondering how long they would be able to “stick it out” in their churches who think some of this emergent stuff borders on heresy and post-modernity is a tool of Satan. One young person actually asked in the panel discussion about how he could stay connected and involved to his church and stay loyal to his denomination and I felt like his question was dismissed. The subtle message is that if you really want to engage this conversation than you have to leave where you are and plant something new. If you stay where you are than you face an uphill battle and this is what leads to the impression that emerging practitioners are “angry” at the church or filled with “post-modern angst”. It seems to me that the emergent leadership does not want to engage in that conversation and that is understandable. Nobody likes to be in conflict or seen as “the angry post-modern pastor”. We all want to be more constructive than deconstructive. The emergent leaders are great, gifted, articulate people with a lot of valuable things to say. I wish there were more venues for them to speak “into the conflict” (which in many ways they are not really in anymore) and still stay constructive. I don’t know if that is even possible. I think that all of the young folks struggling to be faithful in their current churches would benefit from a venue where they could be “supported” in a real way and not just encouraged to hang in as long as possible and then go plant something new. Because the emergent leaders have the freedom to do what they want in their churches I think they have forgotten that there is a whole lot of deconstruction that still needs to take place, at least across this country. Their giftedness and experience can make a huge contribution to this process. There are at least three things I would like to see happen to narrow the gap between the “haves” (emergent leaders who have the freedom to think and speak openly in their context) and the “have nots” (those who are trying to hold to the constructive emergent theology without losing their jobs): 1. I would like to see/hear more about what Tim Conder and Dieter Zander are doing to promote the developing of local emergent cohorts. There was an email sent out announcing this and then nothing more. I realize it cannot take place overnight but an update here and there to let people know it is still on the burner would help. 2. I would like to see more input from the emergent leaders on their own website discussion boards. The village is a great idea in theory but it is not a “safe place” to talk through emergent theology. I think people would benefit from the experience and insights of the emergent leaders on the board. After hearing Pagitt, Keel, Seay and Jones in person I know they have great things to share and can articulately resolve conflict about the themes surrounding emergent theology. But on the discussion boards they are invisible. I think there participation there would allow others to learn how to dialogue constructively and give them a feel for the type of conflict many of us our going through in our churches. 3. Lastly, I wish there was a better venue for people to connect to the presenters at the conventions and conferences. My new friend Nancye would have benefited from a 15 minute conversation with Chris Seay. Just hearing him talk about his working with the old Baptist church that is merging into Ecclesia would have been great for her. But there is no “place” for that. One thing I really liked in San Diego was the luncheon with various presenters. I was able to meet and dialogue with a great thinker that way. And in Chattanooga, Chris was nice enough to sit at our Friday lunch table with 5 complete strangers and simply talk about his church and his books. That was one of my highlights. Seems to me that they could create more opportunities for that. Having a different person at each lunch table (so you could have a Pagitt table, a Jones table, etc) would allow more people to interact in a more holistic way. I realize that this is difficult to do but the benefits to the “have nots” would be great. In the end, it was time well spent. I hope that the comments in this post are not seen in a negative way. I love emergent and all of the hard work the emergent folks are doing to facilitate the conversation. I learned a lot and I appreciate and respect all the people Involved. I thank people like John Atherton for hosting this great event and all the leaders who took the time away from their families to share a busy weekend with us! I am encouraged that there are a growing number of “emerging churches” springing up. I am hopeful that more and more will make this transition. But I am also becoming aware that there is a lot that still needs to be done, especially as the gap between emerging churches and established churches begins to grow ever wider. It is imperative now more than ever that we keep dreaming! posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/10/2003 10:41:00 AM
Chattanooga continued… The second morning began with Tony Jones presentation, “A fresh look at how we teach people to become Christians”. This was the best presentation of the event for me. I really liked Tony’s presentation and he seemed to gain strength as he went on. He spoke with passion about the differences between current evangelism techniques (as illustrated by the CBA) compared to some more holistic attempts that he recently experienced at Taize in France. He hit the nail on the head and drove it!! He spoke about some of the “Jesus junk” that gets sold in Christian bookstores and is displayed at the CBA conventions. As he talked about “Christian” toiletries I had the old hymn going through my head: “What can wipe away my sin? Nothing but the roll from Jesus. What can clean my hole again? Nothing but the roll from Jesus…” There was some great interaction in this with some folks in the audience who did not track with what he was saying and he was very good in his response. I will never forget his response to one question where he answered with the story from the gospels where Jesus answers the question about paying taxes. Tony seems to have reached a really good place personally and it leaked out in everything he did. (I did notice a few people get visibly upset with some of what Tony was talking about, but the discussion was healthy and productive) Next for me was Doug Pagitt’s breakout, “A new theology for a new world”. I think Pagitt is my favorite emergent practitioner. He has such a great mind and his delivery is quick , sharp and witty. I have never seen anyone process information as quickly as he can and generate a response that is articulate. He touched on some nerves in this discussion and at one point had a healthy exchange with someone who has a more fundamentalist view of the authority and role of Scripture in theology. Overall, I thought he made it very clear that we must continue to create theology. The old theology was good but it has expired. He had some good insights on history’s recent changes and how that should force us to think theologically again. He had some great thoughts on Acts 3 and how being like Christ means we sometimes must do things that Christ did not do. This was followed by a panel discussion with all the presenters answering questions. It was good but nothing to memorable if you have been following the emergent conversation for a while. I can’t say enough that it just seems to me that all of them are getting more constructive and less deconstructive since San Diego. I was very encouraged by the way the present the content and think that the movement is in a positive direction. The event ended with a presentation from McLaren on “the story we find ourselves in”. I did not attend this session as Janell and I went shopping for some things for the kids. So what did I gain? I think that I was encouraged to continue the quest towards a new community of faith. I believe that there is some great stuff going on in the emergent scene. They stirred up a lot of things for me to think about and confirmed many things that I was already thinking. But I am disillusioned about how to practice this in my current context. It seems very clear to me that becoming a practitioner of emergent theology in a context that has not embraced, or at least allowed for it, will be fighting an uphill battle. I see a lot of wisdom in planting something new to avoid that fight but I wonder if that is just an easy way out? At any rate, this conference increased my desire to plant something new and get out of the context I am presently in. Seems like timing wise it will all work out very well for everyone. Tomorrow I will write about some of my frustrations with the event and things I am really wrestling with. In the meantime, feel free to let me know if you want more specifics about anything. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/09/2003 03:30:00 PM	Tuesday, September 09, 2003
Chattanooga, Part 2: day one… The two days in Chattanooga were packed with a lot of good things and had several highlights. One of the best things was getting to meet Nancye Blair and her husband Tom. This is a great couple and it was nice to meet them in person and spend some time with them. Most of the sessions I went to were outstanding. Some of the content was the same as San Diego but the attitudes and confidence of the Emergent presenters was better by a long shot. There were still the occasional challenges by attendees who do not agree with the emerging theology but the presenters handled these situations very well. They did not seem as concerned to “defend” their views and get into arguments. They were much more productive and constructive. I thought that was a big improvement over the San Diego event. The first presentation I went to was Rudy Carrasco’s discussion on “ministry in the Latino culture”. It was very positive and constructive. Rudy speaks with passion, conviction and hope. The big idea I gained was looking at people and projecting them into the future. “How can we take the 10 year olds we see today and vision what they should be 25 years from now?” When they are 35 years old what do we want them to be like and what do we need to start doing right now to get there? (I missed the first roundtables as mentioned in earlier post but I heard they were very good.) I choose to attend Chris Seay’s breakout session, “preaching as Midrash”. He wanted to show some video clips and discuss them but the TV was not delivered in time to accomplish this. The content was great with lots of good dialogue and feedback all around the room. The big idea that hit me is that Chris was very comfortable with his convictions. There were a few who disagreed with small things but he dialogued with them beautifully. Here is where I really began to notice the difference from San Diego. There was not “apology” or attempts to explain post-modernity or emergent theology. Just simple, constructive articulation. I remember thinking that it must be nice to be able to work this out in a context of community and wondering if any of the presenters would be able to be this productive in my current church. I think there is a reason all of these guys are church planters… Chris also presented that evenings general session, “evangelism in the real world”. Once again this was very good. If you were at the San Diego conference than you could see this session as a constructive continuation of his Wednesday night session in San Diego. He challenged the current models of evangelism but was positive, constructive and healthy through the critique. Ended with a movie that was made by the children’s community of his church that was very powerful. (He apologized for not showing it in color but I thought the black and white version had a certain power to it that would have been lost in the color version). Then I chose Joe Myers breakout session, “meet me on the front porch: rethinking our placemaking”. This was my least favorite session. (Wish I would have gone to McLaren's "four theological turnings" as I heard that was great) I had a hard time tracking with Joes presentation and disagreed with a few of his thoughts on “belonging” and the four levels he identified. The woman next to me and my wife were both surprised at the number of times he referred to sex. But the time was not wasted. He did have a really good point about placemaking and asked why we try to create places in our churches for connection to take place when there are already places all around us were connection is already taking place (Starbucks, rec centers, taverns, etc…). There is something wrong when we try to recreate this in the church rather than get the church out of its four walls and into the community. So that was the first day in a nut shell. More later… posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/09/2003 02:15:00 PM
Chattanooga Part 1: overview... There was a lot of information crammed into the two days at Chattanooga that I am still trying to process through. I want to talk about some of the good things I got out of the trip and then some of the bad things I experienced/observed. First, though is this short overview. There were some great session topics and some of my favorite ecclesial dreamers were there. So I approached the weekend with high expectations. Scott, Janell and I went early to sit in on the early bird luncheon with Rudy Carrasco. From that point on I was very frustrated with the venue location. There were too many people for the space. Rudy's lunch was great but it went a little long so we were late getting to the roundtable options. By the time we got to the rooms for the roundtable discussions they were overflowing. I tried Brian McLaren's first and it was standing room only. So I went to Tony Jones' and there were people sitting in the hallway outside the room trying to hear because the room was so full. I sat in the hall for a few minutes and could not hear a thing. So finally I left altogether. I went to the library hoping to post a blog entry about Rudy's luncheon talk but the library PC's would not allow access. I got back and hooked up with Janell and Scott. The rest of the conference was better but still had trouble with adequate room space for all the people. All in all it was a great weekend. Sat in on some great discussions (more on that later) and was really stretched and challenged with some things. I feel like I learned a lot and that it was very beneficial. We left Sunday morning and drove to Atlanta and then flew home. During the travel I was trying to reflect on some things and process all the info and began to see a few things in a more negative light (more on that later as well). So I left the confrence with mixed emotions. Overall? The weekend was what it should have been. It was very good in parts and very frustrating in parts. Not sure yet if I think it lived up to my expectations but then again maybe my expectations were unrealistic. IN my next post I will try to highlight some of the good things that went on in Chattanooga. posted by Ecclesial Dreamer @ 9/08/2003 09:56:00 AM	Monday, September 08, 2003